Wind Energy: Rapidly Expanding in Scope “As We Speak”
As noted in this article, the largest wind farm in the world will soon come on line, rated at 2 GW, sufficient to power 800,000 homes.
I mention this because of all the comments, especially from the pro-nuke people, that wind can’t scale up because its energy density and capacity factor are too low, that wind is an intermittent source, etc. It’s unclear how anyone can believe this, given what’s happening in front of our very eyes.
From the article:
“…rated at 2 GW, sufficient to power 800,000 homes.”
One often sees similar statements. However, I really don’t know what they mean. Does it mean that it is sufficient to power 800K homes when the wind velocity is sufficient for the wind farm to generate at its name-plate rating but not at other times? Or does the 800K homes figure take into account the capacity factor? And why don’t they ever state the capacity factor?
When figures are stated, they should state clearly how they were derived. Unfortunately, they never do that. To get that information it is necessary to do considerable digging. I’m quite sure that different people interpret such figures differently.
In all fairness, the capacity factor is not stated when the output fossil fuels or nuclear plants is stated. However, since the capacity factor is generally around 90% for those plants, knowing the capacity factor is somewhat less important.
In spite of the importance of capacity factor, probably the majority of the public is unfamiliar with the term. That should not be.
Craig your exasperation about the subject of wind energy subject is entirely self-generated.
Your zeal in taking on the wind technology detractors such as myself and Frank Eggers rather than applying professionally detached analysis to the subject itself, has neutralised any objectivity you may have (and should have) been able to muster on the subject.
The result is that your commentary becomes nothing more than a series of opportunistic media snippets. It has no mental rigour or engineering trend line reality attached at all.
I see this often.
Good engineers understand the concept of “intrinsic obsolescence” in all engineering design. And they are always mindful of it in discussions.
I always emphasise this point when lecturing young technicians and engineers, and the example I use is the slimline cell phones they all have in their pocket. I owned an original first incarnation cell phone in 1984, it weighed 3 kilograms, and guess what? It looked entirely different to what we have today.
Surprise surprise, what on earth motivated changes I wonder?
You just can’t seem to come to terms with the immutable principle of “intrinsic obsolescence” Craig and this is colouring your view on most subjects I see you write on.
“Intrinsic obsolescence” also applies to commentators, and no one is exempt, including you, me and Frank Eggers. So there is the credibility challenge we all face. And, good luck with that.
Lawrence Coomber
Craig,
Perhaps you should have studied the fine print buried deep in the information Mid-American Energy statement, not just the PR puff ie;
“The company anticipates paying for the multi-billion dollar wind farm with federal tax credits, subsidies and consumer rate readjustments, over the next 10 years ” ….
And why wouldn’t the US Federal Government be so generous to a company owned by the Democrats largest donor, Warren Buffett of Berkshire Hathaway Energy.
In a few short years, Wind Power has become embraced by some of the worlds largest corporations. The scale of investment is colossal, but always underpinned by government guarantees, subsidies etc and regulated markets that guarantee profits.
Recently an excited press report triumphantly proclaimed, “Portugal using 100% renewable energy ! ” . This widely repeated article failed to mention that this “100%” was only achieved for a few hours, in very special contrived circumstances, and was almost entirely due to Portugal’s massive Hydro-electric capacity.
Large scale Wind and solar industries rely upon massive taxpayer/consumer assistance to survive or even justify their existence. These huge industries and the massive international corporation behind these industries have very powerful lobbyists and PR machines working hard to overwhelm any objective analysis.
These corporations are in the fortunate position of people wanting to believe, and willing to ignore the future downsides.
Craig keep on Trucking as the The answers to some of our Energy challenges is Indeed Blowing in the Wind.
spent some time sharing some facts with Frank on this recently.
@ Marco, Lawrence, and Frank
All three of our nuclear Genie Boosters will always find fault and shortcomings. I accept that They have lots of technical knowledge but also see the world in their View and end up like Lawrence is saying.
Lawrence your concept of ” intrinsic obsolescence ” is a fine Critical thinking concept. Kudos to you.
But don’t dismiss the fact that Portugal ran for 3 days on 100 % renewable energy. That is something to celebrate and not berate!!!
One could apply that concept to the 65 year old US nuclear technology that despite the Trillions in subsidy over the time frame and ongoing buried in the DOE budgets has yet to control its cost and design issues. This begs the question – has it fallen victim to the limits of built in obsolescence perhaps?>?
Just posing a intellectual question worthy of serious un biased thought.
Marco all the damn energy sources are subsidized globally and that is so damn well documented . You lose position when you present that and capacity factors as insurmountable barriers. In fact they borderline on Straw Man Issues! Red herrings to be blunt. The International Energy Administration has records on that that back up what I am saying.
It gets boring to hear those Red Herring claims as the gap in funding is so huge.
Despite the documented subsidies to Fossil Fuels and Nuclear supply chains they can’t control their prices , their cost curve is going up while Renewable energy cost curve is going Down!
That is the question or explanation that Begs being answered !
Put that into the reactor so you can burn the FACTS ! Some more Facts that should be considered is neither So Cal Edison and Pacific Gas & Electric Co are planning to replace the nuclear capacity from the closing of their two nuke plants with new nukes! They are not! They are going end use efficiency and Renewable Energy, storage all the way!
Its called the market place!
Take your complaints to their Executives.
Despite the positive attributes of R E , Given today’s capabilities, limitations of RE and the Carbon/ nukes; well All of the resources have a place. They each have to find it.
The exception being coal which should be phased out unless they can find a way to make it clean and at a price that competes. as of right now that does not exist. Despite Billions thrown at it.
So there is plenty of Intrinsic Obsolescence and I call it Deficiency to go around.
The key difference is RE is coming down in price and going up in Performance.! The Bottom Line
Mid America donating to Democrats is not the key to their success. That is right wing BS Marco.
Mid America could buy you and chew you up in a NY minute if it was worth their effort.
They own coal, oil trains, coal plants, gas plants, lots of wind and solar plants , freight trains and associated supply chain businesses. Also some Electric Utilities but they Stay away from Nuclear ! And they are successful and make lots of Money. Has nothing to do with Democratic Party. Perhaps choosing not to dance with the Nuclear Genie is a secret to their success!
In Wyoming when I lived there the former owners of the dirty coal plants there said that controlling the pollution from the plants was Not a Priority – The wind blows most of it North to Canada or East to Nebraska and Dakotas. The limits and hypocrisy of so called Family values in the Red Heartlands are too many and burdensome to recant!
Many soil sampling projects of the Eastern Wy and Western Prairies for those states found high levels of heavy metals and other pollutants including radium, barium and Mercury from the excessive burning of coal. The fish in the lakes look good and taste good etc but one can not eat very much as you will get sick lots of mercury,. etc. etc.
A uranium mine in Western Neb had to get exemptions from the State EPA and the Federal NRC as some of this pollution landed on their property s and raised the sampling results from their property . It caused them permit issues and took money to clear up etc. Cross contamination pollution from coal.
Those conservative right leaning Morons don’t practice being good Stewards to God’s Earth as the pursuit and accumulation of Money (its called GREED) gets in the Way of a Spiritual Pathway for the Morons.
When Warren Buffet bought the Rocky Mtn Power co he did his audits and they are now spending over $ 350 million dollars on coal plant pollution upgrades and another Utility co in Montana/Dakota are upgrading their coal plants or closing them. The massive Colstrip Coal plant a dirty one in Montana is closing 2 of its 4 units as cheaper energy in Oregon, Wash, Idaho and Utah is picking off its West coast market – that source of power is WIND!
So the Wind stream is helping to clean up the air and soil and water and keep fish safe to eat. Wind Power’s value stream is good for society.
AS I said in a earlier post to Frank Part of the Energy Solution is Indeed Blowing in the Wind.
Wind capacity factor rising but it does not have to match 90 % as that is a mythical value for a different ERA that is Over! Yesterday’s metrics no longer apply but I don’t expect the nuclear genie crowd to accept nor comprehend that point as its complexity lies in Power Generation and Planning . The decreased National utility load factors to right below 50 % means Utilities would bankrupt them selves with massive new base load plants plus their customers would be hurt as well. That is why all the smart money is going to SMR’s – so we shall see and they are designed to integrate ( load tracking) with R E sources. A Poignant Point that should not be over looked!
Its like Bucky Fullminister said long long ago, Bigger is not Always Better and Small can be Beautiful.
The concept Value of his long ago quote is bigger than this discussion for sure.
May the nuclear genie finally perform in a few years and reward its boosters with the success their faith has sought all these years. It will be good backup and base load power to supplement all the installed Renewable Power that will be deployed by then.
Carry On Mates