Evidence For and Against Climate Change
In response to my piece called On the Climate Change “Hoax,” a commenter writes: Not a global warming fan. I lived in North Dakota for 2 winters. Minus 30F will remove all thoughts that anything is warming up.
I’ve heard that there are people who think like this, but I don’t think I’ve ever met one until now. You’re aware that the ice near the poles is melting at an incredible pace, that people are dropping like flies in the summer in rural India from temperatures that go into the 120s and stay there for days on end, that the hot seawater destroys vast areas of coral reefs–more every year, and that rising sea-levels are already causing people to lose their homes. But because it’s cold in the winter where you live causes you to disbelieve the theory that is almost unanimously held by climate scientists?
Thanks for your comment, but I’m not sure how to respond to it.
Face it. There is little or nothing that we can do about people who cannot or will not think rationally. Unfortunately, there are many of them.
I am rather curious where the commentor lived in the summers of those 2 winters. North Dakota “enjoys” one of the larger extremes in temperatures on the planet. http://coolweather.net/statetemperature/northdakota_temperature.htm But when it is all averaged out North Dakota is still warming. It is the 21st fastest warming state: http://www.climatecentral.org/news/the-heat-is-on
Good question. I didn’t ask. I try to stay away from discussions (and certainly arguments) with people who think so poorly….
@ happy New years Frank
Your post is so true – sobering truth – a misinformed, under informed , the triumph of lies over facts and truths and FAUX populism along with Millions Millions of Carbon money spent to confuse and deflect the intelligent attention of the mainstream citizens.
lets face it PT Barnum was right when he said “You will never go Broke betting on the stupidity or Over estimating the stupidity of many americans it is in our culture.
given our current political drift the slide continues
The only Question left on the baking table may be how much is ignorance and how much is due to being Stupid and Cultural Influences are a Wild Card !
Per clinical practitioners who deal and treat with Ills of the Mind , soul and being – Ignorance can be healed and corrected but Stupid is forever !
Sad but True yes Sir Frank
Craig,
Many people on both sides of this debate confuse local weather events as evidence of climate change, or evidence that climate change isn’t occurring.
Of far more interest are your alarmist claims:
1) The ice near the poles is melting at an incredible pace.
2) People are dropping like flies in the summer in rural India from temperatures that go into the 120s and stay there for days on end.
3)Hot seawater destroys vast areas of coral reefs–more every year
4) Rising sea-levels are already causing people to lose their homes
Alarming stuff, but how much is fact and how much simply hype and conjecture ?
Here’s my take,(which if anyone’s interested I’m happy to back with a cornucopia of scientific reports and studies).
1) The polar ice caps have retreated and advanced over the last millennia quite dramatically. Although the is some evidence to suggest the polar ice-caps are affected by higher levels of CO2, the size and effects are not conclusive and the ice-caps seem to be affected by a very wide range of influences.
In recent years the antarctic ice cover has actually increased and thickened in some regions while decreasing in others. The reasons for this occurring are the subject of many studies and research, many of which cite other factors than global warming.
Conclusion: A possible contributing factor, but more research needed before determining the percentage and overall effect.
2) Okay, very sad that Indians die each year from heat waves. But in reality there’s no evidence that this has anything to do with global warming.
The much trumpeted 2015 “record’ temperature in Rajasthan reached 51 degrees Celsius (123.8 degrees Fahrenheit). However, in 1956 the temperature was record at 50.8 degrees Celsius, and may have been hotter if measured with the more accurate gauge used to record the 2015 temperature.
Similar temperatures were recorded in 2011 (lasting 3 days) and during the great droughts in the 1870’s.
The deaths are not due to the heat of these events, or the residents of the Australian town, Oodnadatta which regularly records temperatures of 50.7 C. Also, Kuwait with temperatures of over 53 c would be uninhabited !
Clearly, the reason for these deaths is due to inappropriate agricultural practices, overcrowding and disastrous social organization.
Conclusion: Unsubstantiated emotive hype, with no evidence of validity.
3) Despite endless documentaries, the actual science reveals the largest incidence of coral extinction is on the Great Barrier Reef centered around Morton Bay. The bleaching was thought to have many causes, pollution, rising sea temperatures, levels etc. etc.
Recent long term studies have proved these theories erroneous. The huge amount of coral bleaching was due to a four decade long period of warm current allowing the coral to expand and flourish until the current reverted back to a colder stream, destroy the coral.
The same coral that has been the subject of much emotive hand-wringing concerning warming seas and higher levels destroying the coral is debunked by the exact same species flourishing in the much warmer waters of New Guinea !
The authoritative 20 year study by James Cook University concludes the sea levels affecting the Great Barrier Reef have remained pretty constant over the last 5000 years.
Theories regarding global Coral extinction reveal a huge gap between sensationalized advocacy and media coverage versus actual scientific studies. (sorry, David Suzuki enjoying a 5 day diving sojourn isn’t science).
Conclusion: No hard evidence, no scientifically verifiable support for this assertion, mostly media hype and misinformation.
4)Good heavens ! Where ? Never have beach-side properties been more expensive and popular.
Coast lines are constantly changing. This phenomenon is neither nor increasing. So many factors are involved it’s impossible to determine which bit of coast line might be affected by what.
Conclusion: Despite the millions of articles published warning of this occurrence, there isn’t a single instance of one home that can be substantiated as being lost to rising sea levels.
Conclusion; media hype and over active imaginations, or instance where other factors were demonstrably at play, but GW was erroneous attributed as the preferred cause.
So, where does that leave you, Craig ? You appear to be in the position of a kettle calling a pot ” Coloré Noir ” !.
That’s the trouble with being a dedicated advocate, after a while it becomes easier for you to accept things on faith than be objective.
Probably the greatest asset acquired from law school is the ability to argue both sides of any issue. This requires discipline to forget belief and simply gather and compare information.
Mate Marco you presented much great technical details and facts Impressive.
While I dont agree with your conclusions I respect your facts it does show how complicated the issue is.
I go with what the majority around 98 % of the climate scientists say they have more technical expertise in these matters. I respect Dr James Hansen and crew till proven otherwise.
Wisdom is when knows what they both know and what they dont know. We have to let our ego’s go to gather wisdom.
BTW the Exxon scientists knew in late 1970’s from their ocean research that there are issues with carbon burning impacting the greater environment. So the King of Carbon internal research actually supports what the 98 % have been saying over the years.
but I tip my hat to you for nice technical education of facts etc. period. Interesting work .
you enjoy your Barrier Reef expedition and be careful.
look forward to your findings on the Barrier Reef conditions.
Hi Silent,
Thank you for your reply an kind regards. Unfortunately, I’m not able to join the expedition as business matters will keep me freezing my butt off in the UK ’til mid-Feb.
Like Trump, I’m leaving my daughter in charge of organizing the entire expedition!(although with my oldest son (a Doctor)his wife and a highly experienced crew, the kids shouldn’t get in too much trouble !)
I agree with your assessment of Dr James Hansen. He’s a dedicated and sincere individual, and an out standing scientist.
But the often repeated quote about ” 98 % of climate scientists” is a media myth !
The quote comes from a misinterpretation of an IPCC quote, and is very misleading unless the context is included.
What the quote really refers to is a survey by Reuters of publish papers in scientific journals and media covered by Reuters.
Reuters surveys are pretty extensive claiming 78% coverage of major journals and media. However, their methodology is somewhat questionable, since it includes all papers and studies that don’t actually debunk climate change, and include everyone who just doesn’t disagree completely.
The methodology is also based on the number of papers, etc, not the number of authors.
In theory, Dr James Hansen could write a scholarly paper and some troglodyte like Glenn Beck could write 99 papers, making Dr Hansen only 1% !
To avoid this sort of distortion, Reuters decided to include only those authors who are recognized “Climate Scientists”.
Unfortunately, this is a pretty subjective description, resulting in the inclusion of journalist and activist George Monbiot who possess no relevant qualifications, but omitting Richard Lindzen, emeritus professor of atmospheric science at MIT and fFellow of the National Academy of Sciences.
The survey also didn’t consider the possibility of distortion by cross contamination. For example an activist scientist on a committee may submit a paper to more than one journal. The rest of his committee may submit not only papers on his paper, but papers on each others paper.
Thus, quite unintentionally, hundreds of papers can be submitted, but all about the same one paper.
Shamefully, there have been proven instances of this sort of behavior being organized.
So as you can see, the 93 % figure was never accurate, or reflective of anything ! But like all urban myths it’s entered folk lore and re-quoted over and over, even by people who know the truth !
Why ? Well it’s very human to believing a popularly held falsehood that should be true, rather than dull reality !
Your comment “Exxon scientists knew in late 1970’s from their ocean research that there are issues with carbon burning impacting the greater environment” , shows how even a thinking person like yourself can be deluded by subtle media distortions.
In truth you comment should read;
” Some Exxon scientists surmised in late 1970’s from their ocean research that issues with burning carbon may be impacting the greater environment, while other Exxon scientists disputed the findings”.
The difference is one of accuracy. Not easy when passionately advocating a position years later. Your version makes for much better and more memorable rhetoric ! 🙂
My fear is in the passion of ‘crusading’ advocacy, credibility is being lost. It’s an old truth in public affairs, once Joe Public stop listening, it’s virtually impossible to regain support.
Good Morning to you Mate Marco across the Big Pond in rainy chilly England.
That is a shame that you can not make the Expedition that you discussed.
Your first hand assessment of the reef would be welcome information since as you say so many urban myths have gone viral substituting for actual facts.
I would take your observations quite seriously as you are a learned person as well. Your consistent presentation of facts and citations is impressive on certain levels.
On the Global warming thing and my assessment of Exxon Oil ‘s cover up of things since the 1970’s , I take that from interviews with some of the ex Exxon participants who now work in Academia . They may say it differently and the words you use may be different
but the end of the day the result is the same Period. They covered up things and began a well funded smoke and mirror campaign of Distraction, Deflection , Deception and Denial so the moronic public would get more confused and divided on the issue which brings up to the present. It became a virtue to a certain political party and its positions on things. Shame on them.
Time is too valuable to quibble abit with Queen’s English wording etc.
The majority of the scientific community has concluded that there is a Strong case for Anthropogenic ( forget spelling hah ha ) man made climate change.
Common sense and awareness of the big Picture leads me to sleep very well at night believing in GHG dangers and Emissions Etc. its a No Brainer.
Here is a country way to get to all these so called rural undecided Joe blows out there who cling to dis credited and failed policies all over for ideological reasons and not for any deep contemplative considerations. Some even cling for matters of Racial rejections and since it has not happened to me yet, then it must only be happening to darker persons of color over there some where ! Like out a sight outa mind. Such is the cultural myopic limitations of things.
Perhaps this will pass your muster sir:
In the days of Jesus how many planes, powerplants, cars, trucks, industrial sites and what was the population of the earth then ???
In all of these categories except for 1 , which is the population of the world the answer is O None!
Flash forward to today and the Industrialization and population growth , the World Wars and growth in agricultural processes that create and release methane into the sky and the usage of carbon fuels across the Globe is of EPIC proportions.
So is it any Wonder that there is a Ecological consequence to all this carbon burning. ???
The point is Moot unless one is tethered to some False cultural or Politically motivated or even perhaps Financial stake in certain practices.
That is how I see things – pretty simple and plain spoken. No need for Analysis Paralysis!
In my travels over the years when I encounter into discourse with red leaning or climate denying types and we have a civil discussion – I share that Times of Jesus example and facts
This framing seems to resonnate with them and they are taken back with the subtle reality of those Facts and Points. Like they seem to always say – no one ever presented it global warming that way. We separate and I can tell that their false belief system is more about cultural or political and even racial motivations and much much less than it is about a position on scientific evidence. the subtle facts Challenge their root positions with clarity.
What I am saying is that their filter bias their Johari’s Window of how they see the world the Greater world it is easy to be a climate denier. It is a perceived safe position and social class plays into it also. It is almost a badge of Honor for them. A comfort Zone if you will.
So I dont confuse them further with scientific facts…..etc.
But when I interject Jesus into this their ideological bias seems to Shatter and they seem moved. Watching their Castles Melt down is a internally pleasing experience for me. I don’t gloat or anything just shake hands, wish them well and move on…..
Many a suburban lemming are also taken back by the stark reality of my question that I pose to them involving the name of Jesus.
perhaps Jesus would be smiling to know his name brings clarity to the convoluted confusion that many of his children seem to be entrapped under perhaps….
Marco as for the public yes there is a segment that is weary of these big proclamations you have a good point there Sir. But reality is there is also Millions and Millions and its a easy bet to make and Win, more believe in global Warming than deny it.
Since last Sunday my inbox has 3 petitions in my inbox. They announce mass demonstrations planned for the US against the carbon loving ways of the new selected President . So the Trumpet is going to deal with some real Blowback shortly.
the master Apprentice will have to be on the stage soon – its Show and Tell time for him LOL LOL LOL
These are National Events and one of the announcements went to over 5 million persons. Surely by now over 30 million or more have seen the advertisement recruiting participants for operation blowback.
So our streets will soon be filled as the other two were very similar in the circulation. I dont participate in these things as I am too busy trying to eke out a living to a degree doing some projects in a few states .
So there is no need for me to be passionately advocating the issue as there are Millions of others who do a better job of orchestrating such public disruptions.
I make a difference doing Actions. Saving energy and including solar and good energy policy to the channels where it can make a Impact. Actions over Words.
My inbox keeps getting alerts from my circle of friends and colleagues with the same ADS calling for Actions against the new administration.
So 2017 and the next few years the headlines of resistance will be many – this should be interesting on some levels , sad on others and there may be some tragic Blowback from the right ..A MIX of conflicting positions.
Enjoy your Holiday and give us some reports on the Barrier Reefs from your family. I love to learn the real facts about things.
Its warming up and a nice sunny day to go trim my Grape Vines and bask in the Sun abit !
take care over there travel safe Mate.
Silent,
The worst thing you and your friends can do for your cause is take to the streets to protest against the new President and administration.
All you will accomplish is the alienation of the majority, and distract from any lack of performance by the new administration.
At the best you will just appear to be sore losers in denial, at the worst dangerous fanatics. If, as you say, alternate energy will prove commercially viable without taxpayer incentives, then demonstrating is pointless as commercial economics will prevail in your favour.
If, on the other hand, alternate energy technology isn’t adequate, then you will be seen to be demonstrating purely on an ideological basis and be ignored until the next election when your opponents will use your activities against you to all those you alienated.
Science doesn’t require “belief”, it’s either empirically accurate or not.
Too much passionate rhetoric and not enough accuracy has been the principal reason why so many moderates become alienated from environmental discourse. They grow weary of being lectured by well meaning zealots, fanatics and finger wagging ideologues.
At the risk of being immodest, over the last 20 years I’ve been a modestly successful salesman for EV technology. The first thing I learned was to avoid basing my pitch to include a lecture on the environment.
Once potential customers are satisfied with the practical and commercial benefits, they may be wiling to listen to a little about the environmental benefits.
In the UK we remember the bitter turmoil of the 80’s as the Thatcher government imposed long overdue reform on the nation. The UK was fortunate to find in it’s hour of need a leader with such steely resolve to drive the reform process that ended a long period of shabby decline and decay.
Fortunately, America isn’t yet in such a parlous condition. All the US needs is to extend the part of America this is working, to include the part of America that isn’t.
I think in his own bumbling, incomprehensible way, that’s what Trump aims to accomplish. If that’s the case, as Elon Musk points out, Trump it might be possible to assist Trump to be an effective agent of change.
Now if Elon Musk believes it’s better to work with the new administration, rather than stand outside yelling petulant abuse, why would anyone listen let alone join those yelling abuse ?
In the words of a real sixties radical,
“well, I know you’re set on fightin’
but what are you fightin’ for…..?”
Marcopolo,
Your argument is one with which I am very familiar.
During the 1950s, many people who opposed the black civil rights movement asserted that protests and demonstrations were counterproductive, would backfire, and result in hostility against blacks. The actual results indicated that those opposing civil rights were wrong. After decades of little progress, or more accurately, regress, progress occurred ushering in years of progress towards racial equality.
History indicates that being passive is ineffective. Demonstrations and protests can be effective and have been effective in the past.
Hi Frank,
Yes, I agree. But the civil rights demonstations were set in a very different context. The non-violent methods employed by Martin Luther King proved effective primarily because they focused on the unlawful actions by local authorities and received the support and backing of the Federal administration.
In contrast, the violent race riots and Black Panther movement, harmed the cause of race relations.
In the UK, all the violence and passion of the riots and bombings of the ’80’s accomplished was marginalize those who wouldn’t adapt to British renewal. Even today, the remnants of the old left cling to their futile glory days, while completely abandoning the cause for which they fought !
The problem for those who take to the streets against Trump, is they will not be viewed as defenders of anything valid, just Trump haters. Unless his administration offends middle America, radical activity can only make the Trump administration look good in comparison.
When Martin Luther King marched for civil rights in Selma, (thanks to TV) he took with him the goodwill of the majority of Americans and the Federal admistration.
The forces against Civil Rights had no counter-arguments except fear and racism. In contrast, demonstrating against a new President yet to impose any policies, just looks petulant.
Even sincere advocates and Trump haters fail the test when exposed to their own hypocrisy. The ardent demonstrator against Exxon, begins to lack credibility as Eric Sniedermann and the other Democrat Attorneys-general run for cover when asked about the propriety of their own transactions.
Even Craig, who is as sincere as they come, runs for cover when it’s pointed out his hero, James Woolsey, whom he describes as a ” highly principled fellow “, stridently demands Edward Snowden be ” ‘extracted’ by any means possible, (even unlawfully) interrogated by any means that droves effective (presumably torture) tried and hanged by his neck until dead” !
If Donald Trump made such a remark, Craig would be indignantly protesting !
Martin Luther King was equally critical of the flaws in himself and his followers, that’s what gave his movement moral integrity.
All 40 years of ” Ban the Bomb” demonstrations had absolutely no effect .( except retard the development of peaceful usage for Nuclear technology ! )
Scott Pruitt’s appointment to the EPA will receive the support of all Republican Senators and many Democrats who are concerned by the actions of a Federal Agency which believes in can usurp the authority of elected representatives and appointees.
Now I’ll bet Craig, like most progressive liberals, had no idea that the EPA had it’s own (unauthorized) military forces. But like most “believers” he’s unwilling to comment or criticize.
That’s why demonstrations often fail. Once the public perceive hypocrisy, they stop listening.
” We are measured not by the righteousness of our cause, but how righteous we are in our cause. ” – Martin Luther King jr
Marcopolo,
Some of the demonstrators are demonstrating against some of Trump’s specific positions, such as restricting immigration, repealing the Affordable Care Act (Obama care), defunding Planned Parenthood, etc., and cannot be classified as simply being Trump haters.
@ marco – as usual Mate you got to extremes – I stated clearly I am not in involved directly as I just go about my business making small scale RE energy and Energy Efficiency and some voluteeer work on energy Policy with other commited folks.
People have th eright to voice their disgust. And I know that Trumpet does not have a big majority support in america.
the bets going around is when does he get impeached for shady business dealings. He is not perceived well and he only won due to the fact that H R clinton is perceived to be part of the establishment and elites . ( when in fact trumper is what a Con job he did ) . so a weak candidate , over $ 3 billion in free air time by the corrupted news media and the confusion of a angry part of the electorate who allowed their anger and mis understanding of things to drive them like suckers or pawns into the trump aura.
They are already getting upset that they may have to pay for his Bloody Wall that is a waste of resources etc. As Frank said and gave good examples People are protesting many things. Legitimate policy disputes and the number are in Millions Marco.
it is not just Environemntal types it is across the Board. Most of the people Trump is selecting for cabinet are Hacks losers like the one from OKl you mentioned.
You are very inconsistent in writing on this site which is focused on making clean energy a priority and then you support fools like the loser from Oklahoma – what a dis connect.
Your comparisons to what happened in Britain during Thatcher time and what is going on in america is not in alignment. Apples and Oranges as they say.
Our stock market is close to 20000 ( I know its a bubble, unemployment is lowest in decades before and during that fools time Reagan too. Of course the right wing media and boosters out there dont give Mr Obama any credit. I guarantee you and all reading if he was running again he wins hands down. His popularity with the general public is the highest of former Presidents.
All that even after he was stone walled and obbstructed and prevented from really putting stronger policies into play.
His green revolution and saving our auto industry has done and is doing wonders for Economy. Unfortunately too many blue collar idiots and morons and other people including the stock market types who benefited greatly and many owe their jobs to him well they got seduced by the racist , bigot and CON Man – the con man is being right now by the 3 contractors who built the hotel in Wash Dc and he owes them over $ 4 million . so go figure. As I stated most Americans are not that smart and not that intellectually curious
Yes polls state that clearly. Which means his policies are more popular than the right wing media presents , the empty screams of GOP obstructionists
So your point about giving trumper a chance I get ;your hopeful thoughts perhaps. Good for you.
But Marco , there are MILLIONS of people who dont like trump they dont like what he represents , his long trqack record as a CON man and and On and On and On.
His tendency towards fascism light is the point that the gOp crew wants to run his appointments thru in a 1 day session.
That is how fragile the GOP hold on things are. they have to violate the very american ideals that they give swarmy speeches on and lie to the morons who vote for them. they must run all the appointments thru at once.
Because they know that many are Flawed and the longer the reviews go the clock ticks , so we are going to see some divided government and that is the way it is.
Don’t worry about me , its the message and its not mine I am just reporting. Trump lost the popular vote by right around 3 million so he lacks any Mandate or semblance of one. he is on shaky ground within the GOP party for his Russian ties etc.
Protests to protect the environment and keep clean water and air programs viable are what the majority of the American Public wants despite their mental manipulation by the forces that be who shape our politics and funding etc.
I attended a dinner party last night and 5 professional educated men both white and hispanic most with masters degrees all concluded over drinks that they think Trump s quest fro more money will lead to over reach will lead to a big ethics issue leading to Impeachment.
and even the GOP will have to go with it to save their image .
Whether that happens I have no dog in hunt. but anything that slows him down stops his destructive policies is fine with me. He ic a CON Man and also a Buffoon like the British parliament said. Many man educated Americans Veterans etc are very ashamed that he won.
but H R Clinton is a worn out weak candidate who ran a weak race and lost support from within Dem party due to her bad decisions and her husbands bad legacy.
So we ended up w trumpet but that does not mean those of us who are sincere and intelligent have to line up and salute or help him.
like many I know we light candles in the Catholic and Episcopal churches hoping he fails big time. Hope he fails. He is just a CON man. represents the worst of american greed oriented culture.
So I say to all the possible protestors the millions of angry folks , Bring It On It is their right to do so.
Marco if you want to be a go along to get along fellow re Trumpet that’s your choice too.
Thanks Frank you are clear headed. later
Silent,
I certainly agree with you about Old McDonald E I E I O. Even if he does nothing more that is illegal, he has done enough already to be impeached for high crimes and misdemeanors. It seems odd that he has not already been criminally prosecuted for Trump University; he has lost a civil case about it.
Recently some interesting statistics were published. In the poor states where people have the most to lose if the Affordable Care Act is repealed and not replaced with something suitable, Old McDonald was widely supported. Actually, I doubt that the Marmalade Menace and Republicans would dare to repeal the ACA; doing so would be political suicide as more and more of them will realize as they consider the consequences.
One writer asserts that Trumpet will be a very unhappy man as president. He will lose most of his freedom. Being a president has much in common with being in prison, despite being waited on hand and foot.
We are in for an interesting four (or fewer) years.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIWbUjHZFTw
Frank and Silent,
The problem of hoping Donald Trump fails as President, is you are also hoping America fails, hurting all Americans.
Like Elon Musk, Americans will be best served trying to assist the new and politically inexperienced President, abandon impractical policies while achieving modest reform and providing accommodation for the aspirations of the millions who supported him.
I realize this won’t happen. The media and the left, will continue the usual campaigns of divisive politics, like spoilt children at a party who upon finding themselves no longer the centre of attention, will sulk and pout until they get their own way, or spoil the party for everyone.
Dear Frank I love your Ei EI OH slang Fitting fitting
You nailed it. As usual. Our colleague Marco thinks we are some how unpatriotic and should get in line and follow the Devil Like Leemings Do !!
where did his sense of Historical British Logic , Courage , Decency Honor valor Standards etc., and rugged Indvidualism in Aussie land go .. yes the World is changing …casting one’s Lot w the Trumpster is like trying to marry a Harem of Whores and call it a blessed relationship casue the Flowers, wine and champagne was high priced. ….perhaps Marco has business dealings with the trumpster ???
Trumpet and the GOP are like the dog that chased the truck for a long time.
finally the Dog catches the truck ….but then he does not know what to do cause he has no plan that w work. The health care issue will really fester good make em sweat and rethink their idiotic positions. Trumpet and his ilk have No plan for America only nor do they really care for America , their M O is for their inner circle of the economic 1 % plutocrats which is who they are. Said another way the Imposter Emperor Wannna Be has No clothes Indeed !
He paid $ 25 million to buy off the courts for the Fraudster Trump Univ. what slime.
In Texas and in Nm and many other places I have been close to seeing CONs like trumpster shot dead or taken and dragged thru farm fields for doing their selfish greedy acts of Avarice ! Rough Justice but it works to clean out the Scum.
As a youth had Mexican Syndicate contacts that would deliver terminal rough justice to fellows like trumpet. He better stay out of Mexcio lots of Ill will around the Border, was in Del Rio and did some Bars and nite spots and the talk was real crude about him. Both in English and Spanish and Spanglish too !
Mate Marco – today in Washington DC the Federal government opened a case against Exxon Mobil for their violent acts of suppression in certain oil fields in certain countries. Indonesia and others Exxons former CEO – Rex Tillotson the plutocrats the guy trump has nominated to be the SEC of State for the US – well his name is in the indictment so that is the sign of the lack of morality these folks have. The case involves torture, deaths, beheadings, Rape, false imprisonment , stealing and burning natives homes down by mercenary army types hired and paid by Exxon. Blood for Oil profits. One of the survivors of the attacks is a lead witness heard him on radio today. Despicable acts by Exxon.
Al gore was not fooling when he said we are in a race to the bottom ….back in 2000.
so is this a sample of what trumpet means in making America Great again ….a return to those low standards of exploitation. ….its in Federal Court Marco.
So call us leftists for speaking the Truth. The guy is not even sworn in yet and the trail of illicit business only grows.
that is why Marco the majority of Americans are Ashamed of this guy and we dont need any lectures on why that cyber billionaire Musk may be trying to cozy up to trumpet. He is doing this to try and make money and protect his solar stuff. Buying access to the market clear and simple when none should be needed. What a shame.
Oh yes we must worship false and rigged markets not cause they are that way but because we have been conditioned to repeat the chant the empty slogan there is is the wonderful thing called the free market. The only thing free about it is some are free like trumpster and his false college are Free to manipulate and Exploit etc., We have allowed Fraud by the 1 % to be legal!
The tip of the Iceberg Marco
Bring On the Blow back Bring it
Thanks Frank
Silent,
We both think that we have considerable reason to be concerned about what the Marmalade Malefactorous Monster will do as president. However, we could be pleasantly surprised. Sometimes when a person suddenly has great responsibility trust upon him, he rises to the occasion and does an excellent job. Although it seems unlikely that Trump will respond like that (the best predictor of future performance is past performance), there is at least a minuscule possibility that he might. If he doesn’t, which is what will probably occur, it might teach voters a badly needed lesson the benefits of which could outweigh the damage of choosing Trump. Who knows?
Silent,
Whoa! Calm down buddy, you’ll blow a fuse !
I’m not sure advocating the a US President should be:
“shot dead in Texas, taken and dragged thru farm fields for doing their selfish greedy acts of Avarice ! Rough Justice but it works to clean out the Scum.”
…..is in the best of taste, considering events in that state !
The isn’t much difference between advocating violence and warning of it, but somewhere there you kinds crossed the line. (I’m sure unintentionally)
That’s the trouble with rants, they can have unintended consequences, one of which is making your enemy look good in comparison.
@ marco
If your sensibilities get flustered some just let it go…if you want to give the trumpet some respect that is your right but it is ill fitting to give some one like htat respect on this Web site that is supposed to be about looking and discussing technologies that can improve things for society globally.
dont see any of that light in the trumpet!!1
just repeating what is going on out in the world even in Texas.
I gave you a recount of some of the more notable reasons and events which make many people not care for the Trumpet.
love that name Frank the Trumpet.
You should realize that there is a very independent streak in some of us Americans we revel in being social critics and we dont follow the Blind Herd.
if more people spoke up and stopped being so politically correct and going along to get along maybe some Order and Rules would return to society and business etc.
I just shared the Tips of the Iceberg. dont worry we have started recruiting the Rio Valley border boys coalition yet. other things
to do.
But what we dont like is people who are cavalier about the environment and whose motives to do things at any costs , disguised as something else just does not sit right .
Much of what the trumpet stands for does not sit well. he will bring on his own blowback …maybe he ‘ll sober up some ….as Frank gave a chance to as some rascals get the message sooner and change some.
But no lectures on how we must show deference to this CON man. his title is meaningless the Emperor has no clothes that’s the bottom line.
We care about the environment and working towards reducing climate change if possible. later on